Where the hell did 5th go??

[M.F.D.B.]

Just when I thought I found 6th I lost 5th!!

ONE


TWO


THREE


FOUR


FIVE


SIX


SEVEN


EIGHT


NINE


TEN


ELLEVEN


TWELVE


THIRTEEN


FOURTEEN


FIFTEEN


SIXTEEN


SEVENTEEN


EIGHTEEN


So do you guys think I should replace all the gears that have rounding even if its only slight?? All gears engage fine cept 5th, all you get is clanking and revving.

Also i'd like some opinions on a root cause before I approach my buddy who was riding the bike last weekend.

Heres the senario. Around the end of the first day of riding he comes to me at the bottom of Comp and says "the clutch is slipping". So I jump on the bike, make sure the clutch is adjusted right (when I got on the bike, the cable was too loose so the bike would try to go even with the clutch pulled all the way in. So I adjusted it and went for a spin, towads the top the bike would feellike the clutch was slipping when it was actually skipping in and out of gear. I only rode in for 30 seconds and we went back to camp. I had another buddy coming out the next day so I had him bring my spare clutch but when we pulled the clutch it was fine. So all I did was swap the springs and told him to "go give it a try". He comes back and says it seems fine now and goes out on a ride with Danny (i stayed at camp to work on a quad). He goes home that night so the next day I take the bike to the "face" to try it out (I had just put on a new exhaust and hadnt riddin the bike yet, since he was on it I rode the 450 all weekend). I hit the hill a few times only getting into 4th gear, all is well. Then I hit 5th and the bike false neutrals and I almost wreck. I try it a few more times, nothing, will not go into 5th gear at all, only revs up and makes a grinding noise. So ofcoarse I shut down and go straight back to camp. This is what I find when I tear it apart. Im thinking since he dodnt stay on top of the clutch adjustment when the cable became loose enough to not fully disengage he must have bent the 5C fork and that cause it to stripo the dogs?? He did tell me that "the bike doesn want to shift and I think the clutch is slipping"...So by then 5th was on its way out...

1) Would you guys replace the rachet plate as well (its dimpled by the pawls).

2) Replace only 5th and 5C?? Or replace the gears that have slight dog rounding as well??

3) Anything I might be missing?? I dont want to replace the fork, the gear(s) and have this happen again because I didnt find the actual cause??

The GF just bought me a lighting kit too so I was hoping to have the bike back together with lights for the next Dunont trip (9th-11th) but I wont slap it back together just to have to take it back apart.

P.S. The shift drum looks fine.

[iggys-amsoil]

Before I read that I wouldn't blame your bud.

Just replace the two and fork and be done with it.

And in one word..... Amsoil.

Now that I've read the post ya the two gears and fork.

When my tranny was apart most all the dogs had some rounding to them. Apparently this is normal. At least until it gets to far. Not much else one can do cept use the clutch for every shift. Ummm ya right.

[M.F.D.B.]

Before I read that I wouldn't blame your bud.

Just replace the two and fork and be done with it.

And in one word..... Amsoil.

I run Amsoil in everything I own...Im a "Preffered Customer" so I buy by the case.

MCF 10W-40 for the Cbr1000rr, and winter in the 450.
MCF 20W-50 for the 500, summer in the 450.

I used to run the Dominator but had problems. Havnt had any since the switch to 927.

You dont think my buddy had anything to do with it?? Ive owned the bike for a few years and this is the first trans problem. When I rebuilt it last year with all new bearings, seals and gaskets all was well...

[iggys-amsoil]

I was just pokin with the amsoil thing.

Fifth gear seems to be the weak link in the tranny in these beasts. Per the other board.

See edit above.

[iggys-amsoil]

I know the kid that had mine bike before me rode the piss out of it, so its only a matter of time for my tranny.

[M.F.D.B.]

I know the kid that had mine bike before me rode the piss out of it, so its only a matter of time for my tranny.

Did you look at the 5C fork?? I dont think that was normal wear!! Something caused a major failure and I just want to be sure its fixed before I put it back together...

BTW does the slight scoring on the tips of the 5L and 5R look like normal wear??

[AlisoBob]

I think NOW is a perfect time to put the o.d. gear set in!

http://madmanengineering.com/wideratio.htm

[M.F.D.B.]

I think NOW is a perfect time to put the o.d. gear set in!

http://madmanengineering.com/wideratio.htm

I'd love to, if it wasnt $660!! (Looks like I can get away with only replacing 5th gear right now)

Do you guys know if the 5C fork does more then just shift 5th gear??

Should I replace all 3 forks/shafts?? I wish I knew exactly what each fork does, is there documention??

[dannygraves]

damn dude, your whole tranny looks hammered, your best gear looks worse than my 2nd gear I described to you last week! and I never clutch to shift...EVER. someone has been hammering your shifter HARD to bang up that plate like that. Looks like whoever was banging stuff around bent that C fork. I perfsonally would get the c fork and 5th gears, the gears are really pricey, so even though it would be a good idea to replace them all, you could probably get an entire cr500 motor on ebay for that same cost and pull the trans out and have tons of spare parts.

[AlisoBob]

This is exactly why I run the best motor oil I can in the tranny.

Hardparts are expensive and cumbersome to replace.

Cheap oil and ATF dont get it done, in my opinion.

Rounded dogs and blue forks are from wear and friction.. Quality lubrication can help reduce these effects...

[dannygraves]

I think NOW is a perfect time to put the o.d. gear set in!

http://madmanengineering.com/wideratio.htm

I'd love to, if it wasnt $660!! (Looks like I can get away with only replacing 5th gear right now)

Do you guys know if the 5C fork does more then just shift 5th gear??

Should I replace all 3 forks/shafts?? I wish I knew exactly what each fork does, is there documention??

I went through it all last year when I had everything apart, just put the right case half together with the trans and rotate the drum to see what happens, maybe put the clicker wheel and spring back on and use a deep 12mm to rotate it one click at a time which rotatling the shaft and see what goes where and when. its easy to see what gaer your in because to can spot neutral on the drum where that clicker is.

[M.F.D.B.]

This is exactly why I run the best motor oil I can in the tranny.

Hardparts are expensive and cumbersome to replace.

Cheap oil and ATF dont get it done, in my opinion.

Rounded dogs and blue forks are from wear and friction.. Quality lubrication can help reduce these effects...

I run Amsoil full synthetic and I change it every other ride...

[AlisoBob]

You do, but what about all the other owners?

Wear patterns from prior use cannot be corrected later down the line.... no matter what lube you run.

[dannygraves]

the funny thing is my trans is in great shape and when I got the the drain plug was stripped and MAYBE 200cc on gray nasty overused oil came out...
but then again, the last guy barely ever rode it (he said it was too much work to start and ride ) I think the previous guy before him (who had AMA stickers all over the thing) replaced the whole trans.

[M.F.D.B.]

You do, but what about all the other owners?

Wear patterns from prior use cannot be corrected later down the line.... no matter what lube you run.

What oil cant fix JB Weld can!!

What do you guys think about that metal powder radiator stop leak in the trans?? That should fill in all the little groves??

[dannygraves]

You do, but what about all the other owners?

Wear patterns from prior use cannot be corrected later down the line.... no matter what lube you run.

What oil cant fix JB Weld can!!

What do you guys think about that metal powder radiator stop leak in the trans?? That should fill in all the little groves??

I bet we could put some in a bottle and give it a cool name and put a really cool label on it that shows a bike throwing some serious roost and sell it to flatbillers for $50/bottle!!!

[M.F.D.B.]

You do, but what about all the other owners?

Wear patterns from prior use cannot be corrected later down the line.... no matter what lube you run.

What oil cant fix JB Weld can!!

What do you guys think about that metal powder radiator stop leak in the trans?? That should fill in all the little groves??

I bet we could put some in a bottle and give it a cool name and put a really cool label on it that shows a bike throwing some serious roost and sell it to flatbillers for $50/bottle!!!

SWEET!! DO IT!!

[M.F.D.B.]

Ok so the consensis is replace the 5C fork only (shaft too??) and 5th gear and put it back together??

I still havnt heard anyone comment on what the cause was.

My opinion is my buddy bent the 5C when the clutch went out of adjustment...(he said it was "hard" to make it shift, so i think he forced it enough to bend it)

[lewisclan]

Im not sure but the dogs rounding off is from general use things ware out if you dont use the clutch when shifting if happens more offten .I know if it happend to one of my bikes when someone was riding it ......
it would have happend if it was me too as far as the bent shaft ? maybe he did but only because he couldent ID the semptom of wore out dogs I know the 1st time it happend to me I was wondering WTF was going on as it was only happening in 2nd and only if I was nailing it I road it around until complete failure.

[M.F.D.B.]

$470.10 w/3day air...

Both shift shafts, all 3 forks, 5th gears, all gaskets and seals (no more K&S junk).

Luckily I already had about half the OEM seals or it would have been over $500...

Im going to ask him to pay for the gears and the 5C fork.

I replaced the 5L, 5R and shaft since the forks had a bit more wear the I'd like to see and when I rolled the shaft on glass it "woggled" just a bit. Hopefully forks arnt like cam lobes are with used lifters...

So if I have gear probs later on down the line I know its time to replace all of them. So maybe a good Christmas present from you guys would be the wide ratio mad man kit...HINT HINT...

I know it would be better to replace everything at once instead of section by section, but its just to friggin expensive this close to christmas. Especially with my girl just buying me a lighting kit (for the hundy) and ASV levers (for the Fo fitty) yesterday...

[dannygraves]

you've got yourself a good girl there... my wife won't let me spend my own money on refurb ASVs and yours buys new ones for you and a lighting kit!
I hate you!

[ISBB]

That sucks about the tranny but hey it could be worse...

I know how the spending is as well... My wife has a fit anytime i come home with something new for the bike... guess i better not tell her i just dropped 120 bucks on race gas hehehe

[dannygraves]

That sucks about the tranny but hey it could be worse...

I know how the spending is as well... My wife has a fit anytime i come home with something new for the bike... guess i better not tell her i just dropped 120 bucks on race gas hehehe

I buy everything online and have it shipped to work! I use credit cards she doesn't have access to (in my name from b4 we were married) to buy bike parts!
sometimes she gets a little suspicious when she sees all this shiney new stuff in the garage...usually I make something up and say that MFDB or hoofarted (my cousin) gave it to me! LOL
With my AF conversion I had to make it very clear that I was selling the motor and the old roller to make up the costs... but she buys $40 shampoo

[iggys-amsoil]

What do you guys think about that metal powder radiator stop leak in the trans?? That should fill in all the little groves??

I bet Brit wants to buy some of what you have been smoking.

I saw the C fork. If one keeps trying to get fifth, jamming it / holding it in that will happen to a fork. If the shafts are straight and the fork does not rock back and forth on the shaft then the shaft is good.

[100hp honda]

i have 4th ,5th, shafts and forks....i MIGHT part with them. measure your shafts and forks and i can tell you what numbers they should be then decide if you need new ones. i have all the thrust washers also