FUEL INJECTED CR500 DONE.

bigred1977 · Post by **bigred1977** » January 15th, 2012, 12:02 am

sweet as mate , i respect your analogy,please dont take it to heart,am a bit of a windup merchant at times,but honestly i just went with the flow,regards.good on ya for standing strong.admire it.

NightBiker07 · Post by **NightBiker07** » January 15th, 2012, 12:34 am

Woah. I wasnt trying to start a shitstorm, nor did I want anything serious divulged. I understand developing something to sell, especially something as complicated as an FI system, all I was getting at was for you to present something that would make the smarter guys truly have some faith in this presentation, it would have certainly gotten guys to back off, myself included. your counter arguments surely made me madder than the lack of proof, Bigred1977. Anything that advances either the sport or our beloved 2-stroke is

with me.

Lets just say at this point I look forward to your proof in the form of a product. But after having dealt with forums full of BSing assholes, I hope you understand my skepticism and picking you apart as such. Heard too many lies to just swallow anything I hear anymore. Especially unproven claims of such a huge advancement. I believe quite a bit more now

NightBiker07 · Post by **NightBiker07** » January 15th, 2012, 12:42 am

Is there a reason you chose the Yamaha chassis to experiment with after completing the conversion? Seems like it would have been easier using a Honda chassis as you would have only had FI hurdles to overcome instead of the hurdles of putting the Honda into the Yammi chassis.

bigred1977 · Post by **bigred1977** » January 15th, 2012, 12:44 am

thanks man,ill put some more up soon,few more things to sort out,not technical more political,eg owner of the bike!has to have a magazine shoot too,ill post the link to the write up,ben townly and peter broxholme are close friends with the owner and they are revving him up for it all the time!! keep you posted.i think he just doesnt want to give up his new toy!!!!if you no what i mean,am just the bored mechanic builder, so ill let them sqauble it out for a bit....

bigred1977 · Post by **bigred1977** » January 15th, 2012, 1:00 am

the owner of the bike has a 1985 cr 500 he rides in vintage, he had the 010 450 for his main bike,but like all 4 smokes boom,it was a $8000 nz rebuild,he has seen the afs i build and put out, and asked me to do it to his 450!!!!!!!!!!!!!!well it was a challange because to commit to the unkown and get that airbox to work required some nutting out,simply they would be a britincali to convert usinga carb,you would have to fab a airbox to hug the rear shock area,and it is small.so as you can see i made the intake manifold to be vertical,(beuty of fi throttle body can go any where!)funnily enough it has a less restrictive flow than a stock one due to the reed face on the cylinder angling upward,so from that point the tb slips on the the intake shoots off at aright angle under the tank over the top stay to a custom plenum type chamber finally meeting the air box.other factors were,the bike has full ohlins set up for the owner,and i suppose just doin a different chassis appealed,crfs are cool,nothing wrong and i would have one any day,but they are common now.the yzf450 shocked me when i got the cr500 and it fitts straight in the cradle and between the swingarm!,actually accomodated better than the crfs at this point,the ecu is hand built and locked out,the tb is 44mm,i have used components from the original yzf injection,but not much really just the sensors,but everything has to be calibrated and checked and bench simulated for correct commuinication,then when you think that is right,let me tell you this cr500 vibration puts out a resonance freqency that is measurable with a signwave optoscope,and its frequencychanges trhoughout and plays havoc with the standard approch to fuel injection,this alone took a while to sus out as it made for numurous,resistors and diode combinationation to buffer this signal but for the system to still be talking correctly.this is just the tip of the iceberg,i have learnt a shit load about fuel injection all over again since trying it on a sigle cylinder two stroke the dynamics are truly different.

Rue · Post by **Rue** » January 15th, 2012, 7:40 am

bigred1977 wrote:this just gets better!! asshole merit badge!! send it to me and ill have it super imposed on the bike i promise!!! i imagined hulk hogan on his microphone wrestling voice presenting me the honours...

Now that you said that I hear Macho Man Randy Savage, I just forgot the oooh Yeaaaah!!!

freeride588 wrote:I truly had no issue with you Bigred. Your bike looks very nice and i am just a guy that likes to ride a cr500 and will never build or design a system like the one that you have. My issue with you is your typical yanks comment and the whole attitude behind it. You start making broad general comments like that and im going to tell you to fuck off whether you designed a badass FI system or not.

X491

That was my issue as well, I didn’t care for his attack on our intelligence nor the Yankee comment. I think it's great that all of us have the same passion and luv for the CR500 and two strokes in general and that guys like himself can apply their ingenuity and find ways to improve the 500 in ways that couldn’t be done otherwise. Because no one that I know of offers an off the shelf FI system for the 5hundy. If it were not for this site, I wouldn’t have been able to build my AFC. I’ve learned a lot form the fellow hoons and look forward to learning even more. I appreciate their willingness to share their trials tribulations and ways to improve the way it’s done in order to have a refined product. I look forward to see your feedback and updates. Good luck to you, it will definitely be an item on my wish list

pstoffers · Post by **pstoffers** » January 15th, 2012, 8:48 am

Roostius_Maximus wrote:
bigred1977 wrote:fukin retards,the video is on u tube and you have pics,wtf!!!!from the way you cunts carrie on am gonna have to disect the fukin thing with idiot stickers for you to understand.my god i thought woman were hard to get through too. cabbages. i like that bullshit meter,and the fuk off little kiwi fruit made me laugh out loud,least you lot are up for a good banter.somat i suppose

If i posted that brit was caught getting a handjob from a homeless dude you guys would consider it solid truth before you were done reading it.

Bigred1977 takes a few minutes to post up something that seriously happened and theres a friggin attack on him.
This is why most good things don't hit the net. I'm not saying there should be an ass-kissing over getting something done, but have some respect that the guy considered posting it here for your criticism. You could have found it in a magazine article or somewhere else and learned even less about it.

Post by **AlisoBob** » January 15th, 2012, 9:51 am

I see it like this.....

Scenario#1

You want to develop a FI set-up to sell, so you develop it in 100% secrecy and spring it on the world as a compete bolt on kit, with a 1-800 number support line.

or

Scenario #2

You come to a 2 stroke centric spot on the web and show your wares to gain some real world feedback, and get a buzz going about your product. You explain its currenly a working model thats battery powered, but as soon as a power source is developed its going into production. You add some techinical bits and a photo or two to prove the current state of things.... not enough to give the farm away.... but enough to show its the real deal.

You've done neither....

I dont need photo's, but at least answer some questions about the damm thing?

Is it battery powered at this point?

Open or closed loop?

User programable?

Constant flow, or pulsed?

Alcohol compatible?

What parameters does it measure?

Will it "Limp Home"?

bigred1977 · Post by **bigred1977** » January 15th, 2012, 10:47 am

yeah fair enough bob.

right the ecu is fully programable every variable can be controlled there are fuctions for lauch control,nitrous control and even turbo control,it is fully compatable for alcohol,methanol,but would obviously require some tuning,it is accessed by laptop and a simple cable,tunes are loaded by three buttons.
the bike at the moment is running a custom stator and power source so is using a capacitor type voltage supply,although if you wanted to run lights or accesories you can simply put in place a battery,this does not have to be a big bulky battery and i have sourced a few options for this part of the kit.it is alpha n and speed density tuned,as map readings are pretty much none existant,all crf kxf fuel injection are alpha n only.
there are start up enrichment options,decel,acel inrichment options.
but at the moment we are keeping it user freindly and as soon as it starts you are closed loop.
std 43psi fuel preasure
max 4 amp draw on system
power is up on stock,we have yet to do a final dyno run,will do this in the next few weeks,throttle response is awsome and it is very smooth and linear,the fi has certainly aided in getting round the flatish top end of the 500... like i say i would like to do some kits,but i am not a rich man myself and want to make them as affordable as i can for everyone,this will be the delay in releasing the kits as now i have finalised the spec of the components i am trying to source the best wholsale prices without compromising on reliability and quality,tall orders but i am trying.
my intention was never to make any money from this or set out to develope a kit, i set out to make one customers bike work,it worked and worked out great,so i thought i may as well let others have it too, i am after all a strict two stroke fan and cr500 addict so i would like to see beast kick the 4 smokes not just in power reliability and low maintanance,but also silence them in technology.i suppose that was my primary driver for this exercise,bringing the cr500 up to the line in spec.

bigred1977 · Post by **bigred1977** » January 15th, 2012, 11:00 am

i forgot too mention that the ecu has full data logging capabilites too i have found this quite fun if anything you can pretty much record any parameter overlap them check your riding style through sensor feedback
we will be looking at making the ecus tunable on the fly by using the droid phone,so eventually you can ride without any care for tuning and have your laptop in the truck receiving all the info or even your tech mate tuning as you ride,it is through this toying around i hope to make the cr5 more tractable and more ridable thatn any four stroke, abig call but its what i am aiming for.

Post by **AlisoBob** » January 15th, 2012, 11:01 am

bigred1977 wrote:....the bike at the moment is running a custom stator ...max 4 amp draw on system

14v x 4 amp is about 60 watts.
Your stator setup puts out 60 watts at idle?

This is where you could make some money....

asteroid500 · Post by **asteroid500** » January 16th, 2012, 3:51 am

theres no photos or close ups as it dosnt exist ... fkc if i do a write up on any mod i do im as proud as punch to post it with details a quality pictures ... what you get with this thread is a lot of black & white but no color ... in that i mean no quality close up pictures of the siad mod ... its like the picture of the 3rd gun man on the grassy knowle .... looks like a blur to me

bigred1977 · Post by **bigred1977** » January 16th, 2012, 11:26 am

your dead right mate,because there are no close up photos in focus it does not exist.sorry about that.

Post by **AlisoBob** » January 16th, 2012, 11:44 am

I want to see photos of the stator. Surely you can post photos of that..... right?

coley13 · Post by **coley13** » January 16th, 2012, 10:55 pm

asteroid500 wrote:theres no photos or close ups as it dosnt exist ... fkc if i do a write up on any mod i do im as proud as punch to post it with details a quality pictures ... what you get with this thread is a lot of black & white but no color ... in that i mean no quality close up pictures of the siad mod ... its like the picture of the 3rd gun man on the grassy knowle .... looks like a blur to me

who cares, let him develope it. Instead of asking for pics, build your own system. You lot are like a bunch of school girls having a period for the first time

bigred1977 · Post by **bigred1977** » January 17th, 2012, 7:48 pm

final dyno tune results today

bigred1977 · Post by **bigred1977** » January 17th, 2012, 7:52 pm

get a better upload sorted

bigred1977 · Post by **bigred1977** » January 17th, 2012, 7:53 pm

sory about the poor qaulity i use tiny pic.com for uploading to the forums.

http://www.youtube.com/user/500bigbore · Post by **Roostius_Maximus** » January 17th, 2012, 8:01 pm

Try the forums picture hosting instead

bigred1977 · Post by **bigred1977** » January 17th, 2012, 8:28 pm

how?[/img]

bigred1977 · Post by **bigred1977** » January 17th, 2012, 10:29 pm

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asteroid500 · Post by **asteroid500** » January 19th, 2012, 5:43 pm

who cares, let him develope it. Instead of asking for pics, build your own system. You lot are like a bunch of school girls having a period for the first time[/quote]

I tell you who cares ... every one watching this tread. "dick head'
& with any help im sure some one will have a go at doing there own.

2strokeforever · Post by **2strokeforever** » January 19th, 2012, 8:41 pm

do you have another bikes chart from the same dyno to compare too,

personaly i find it very hard to believe that FI will give 10 more hp than a properly tuned carb, specialy at WFO, carbs work great WFO

not questioning your integrity but maybe that dyno is reading high?

coley13 · Post by **coley13** » January 19th, 2012, 10:18 pm

asteroid500 wrote:
I tell you who cares ... every one watching this tread. "dick head'
& with any help im sure some one will have a go at doing there own.

i'm watching, i dont care. I'm sure you have a mangina, i dont need to see pics of it, i really dont. Doesnt mean it's NOT real or fabricated and subject to abuse. Wake up to yourself

Develope your own i couldnt give a shit to behonest, i hope it's a better effort than the basic apptitude needed to be able to quote someone properly on a forum.

bigred1977 · Post by **bigred1977** » January 19th, 2012, 10:35 pm

no i dont have another bike dyno to compare to it costs me a hundred bucks an hour to dyno,so i couldnot give a fuk what else puts out what,ive done my tuning,and this is what it is.simple as that,if u understand fuel injection and its full tuning parameters am sure you would understand the chart some more,all i can say is this every 250rpm can be adjusted in ay throttle positon from 0 to 100% so o to 10,000 rpm every 250rpm,so there are over 4000 individual fuel sites that i can tune if need be i think if you actually can grasp the technicality of tuning compared to a carb,you may well be a bit more acepting of the results,at the end of the day how do you know? i did not,fi could of been a fail on the cr5,who knew?it was a gamble on theroy,i took it it paid off,results were good.simple as that really.

BannedCR500Riders.com

FUEL INJECTED CR500 DONE.