Why Castor?

[2strokeforever]

look at the skirts, 20$ says amsoil would seize before that hole got there, but for sure there would be a shitload of scoring

amsoil dominator fire point 198f

amsoil saber fire point 237f


maxima 927 fire point 480f

amsoil better? at less than half the temp it lights up and dissapears

im guessing blenzall is even higer because its 100% castor and 927 is only 40% i think

[fastkart]

That looks like detonation burning a hole in your piston, your pre-mix oil isnt going to effect the damage from this...

It was definately lean, which leads to why I post the pic... lack of new oil, high temps and still lubricating. When I tore it down, the piston and sleeve were still coated in oil.

[AlisoBob]

When I tore it down, the piston and sleeve were still coated in oil.

[M.F.D.B.]

It was definately lean, which leads to why I post the pic...

Or, too low octane, or too much advance...

[100hp honda]

typically i think your true castors are 550+ fire point. not sure how that fits into the big picture because im no chemist

[fastkart]

It was definately lean, which leads to why I post the pic...

Or, too low octane, or too much advance...

Lean, fo' sho. It was the end of the race season, motor had 2 nites from fresh, used fresh C12 (used C12 all year), timing wasn't changed, but the temp was about 25* cooler than the previous race and the humidity was down too, but I failed to rejet.

[2strokeforever]

typically i think your true castors are 550+ fire point

either way when it gets hot synthetics cant compete with castor

[durkn]

I've been using 927.
I've been mixing it at 40:1, but it seems like I should use less oil.

What are you guys mixing at?

[AlisoBob]

40:1

The rod big end bearing is the hardest thing to lube.

Some guys run oil ratios out to 50:1, and say.. " The piston looks fine!!"

Its not the piston they should be worrying about.

[Tharrell]

I've been using Klotz.
I used the Techniplate but switched to Benol which is total castor.
I mix at 32:1

I just rebuilt my 2001 CR250 and it's had nothing but Benol.
I'm gonna pull the topend at the end of this season and inspect.

http://www.klotzlube.com/techsheet.asp? ... bmit2=View

Smoke Rating: 5 1 = fog - 10 = no smoke
Clean Burn™: 5 1 = heavy deposits - 10 = no carbon
Film Strength: 10 1 = failure - 10 = no wear
Pour Point: -9°F
Flash Point: 555°F
Maximum RPM: 10,000
Viscosity @ 100°c: 15.7 cSt Typical
Product Color: Red

[AlisoBob]

I'm not a Klotz fan.

Jay has race motors, play motors, trail bikes, hillclimb bikes, dune bikes..... every kind of CR500 you can imagine.

All run Klotz and he's had more than his share of piston issues.

'927 or Blendzall for me.

[Tharrell]

I used to run Blendzall back in the 70's.
Wonder why he's had problems with Klotz?

I was just on the Blenzall, Klotz and 927 pages snooping around.
I considered Blendzall and 927.
I guess I'll need to get off Benol for the winter.
What to use then?

[100hp honda]

I'm not a Klotz fan.

Jay has race motors, play motors, trail bikes, hillclimb bikes, dune bikes..... every kind of CR500 you can imagine.

All run Klotz and he's had more than his share of piston issues.

'927 or Blendzall for me.

im sure theres more to the story than brand of oil . one guy said this on another site: qaulity can not make up for qauntity....ever

jerry hall said this just few weeks ago: On a premix type of lubrication system my experience has shown that one should mix the fuel / oil ratio for the worst-case situation. An engine that is ONLY going to idle will get all of the lubrication it needs at 80 to 100 to 1. A two-stroke that is at high rpm and has had its throttle wide open for more than about 5 seconds needs a 15 to 20 to 1 ratio. The oil injection systems on the snowmobiles and boat engines mix the oil with the fuel at the above ratios to suit the rpm and throttle position . After working on thousands of two strokes for over 35 years the oil ratio has proven to have a much larger role in engine reliability than the brand of oil in the general purpose two-strokes. In the most extreme cases like the 50 hp 125cc engines, the castor oil gives use the longest engine life. My testing has also shown that my two-stroke engines will make more power at 15:1 ratio than a 50:1 ratio if you have any tuning abilities.

It makes me happy when I see my customers engines smoke. It tells me that they are not going to have lubrication related failures. If you are having problems fouling spark plugs, you are using too much oil for the way you are riding your bike or you need to work on you carb tuning skills. One must mix the fuel, tune the carb and then ride it for the application for which it was tuned or suffer the consequences.

An engine use for recreational purposes usually needs more oil in the gas than a drag engine. It is not uncommon for recreational riders to spend 10 to 15 seconds or more running wide open down a dirt road or doing laps in a bowl at the sand dunes. The oil layer that is on all surfaces in the crankcase may not even reach the stabilization point when the throttle is closed on a drag engines extremely short periods of full throttle. The criterion that determines how much oil should be used in the fuel is the time spent at wide-open throttle! An 80 cc moto-cross engine will spend much more time a wide open throttle than a 250 on the same moto-cross track. … so the 80cc needs more oil in the fuel than a 250 for moto-cross application. Put a paddle tire on a 250 or run a 250 in a desert race and now the 250 requires as much oil in the fuel as the 80cc engine.

[bwalker]

In a CR-500 the rpms are pretty low. I have no reservations in regards to using Yamalube 2R at 32:1 for trail and MX use and at 20:1 for the dunes. It burns very clean at these ratios with the caveat your jetting is on, protects well during long term storage (like our 6month long winters..) and mixes/stays mixed well.
Castor's forte' IMO is shifter karts, 125's and the like that run screaming RPM's at high loads, yet are tore down frequently.
With that said if I was going to use an oil with castor in its formulation it would be Maxima 927. Its cleaner than most castor oil blends and I suspect it doesn't have alot of castor in it.

[mr500]

I used to be a big fan of 927 at 40:1 but after having sticking rings / power valve on my KTM 300 and decomp valve on my 500 I had to say good bye and moved to Amsoil Saber 80:1.
I been running everything at this ratio and its super clean, all trail ridden so maybe not the best conditions for 927 anyway.
When I would go to start a bike after sitting for a while using 927, I would have to drain the carby or they wouldn't start and a stream of brown crap would come out.
With Amsoil Saber it seems to have a fuel stabilizer as there is no need to drain the carby ( If I do fuel is clear blue) before starting.
I have run 100 hours at 80:1 on my 300 and replaced the piston it came out nearly prefect. The ring gap was still in spec using Saber while the previous piston using 927 after 100 hours the rings were way under spec.
I later drowned the bike and later noticed a slight bearing noise, when stripped down one crank bearing had rust marks, the rod bearings were perfect and in spec and had no signs of overheating.
Replaced both crank bearings and all was good again.
In Aus Saber is half the cost of 927 and I'm using half as much per tank as well!
I feel as long as you follow the oil manufacturers recommended ratio you can't go too far wrong.
Just my experience.

[exit90a]

I used to be a big fan of 927 at 40:1 but after having sticking rings / power valve on my KTM 300 and decomp valve on my 500 I had to say good bye and moved to Amsoil Saber 80:1.
I been running everything at this ratio and its super clean, all trail ridden so maybe not the best conditions for 927 anyway.
When I would go to start a bike after sitting for a while using 927, I would have to drain the carby or they wouldn't start and a stream of brown crap would come out.
With Amsoil Saber it seems to have a fuel stabilizer as there is no need to drain the carby ( If I do fuel is clear blue) before starting.
I have run 100 hours at 80:1 on my 300 and replaced the piston it came out nearly prefect. The ring gap was still in spec using Saber while the previous piston using 927 after 100 hours the rings were way under spec.
I later drowned the bike and later noticed a slight bearing noise, when stripped down one crank bearing had rust marks, the rod bearings were perfect and in spec and had no signs of overheating.
Replaced both crank bearings and all was good again.
In Aus Saber is half the cost of 927 and I'm using half as much per tank as well!
I feel as long as you follow the oil manufacturers recommended ratio you can't go too far wrong.
Just my experience.

Very interesting. Why did you choose Saber over Dominator or Interceptor? Currently restoring a 1997 CR500R and plan to use one of these three Amsoil products. Still trying to determine which would be best and at what ratio. Mostly trail riding with the occasional hoon.